Hmmm, I don't know exactly what I mean by this but something about Lynch's work annoys me. I think it basically comes down to bad storytelling. Watching INLAND EMPIRE I was sucked in by the atmosphere, the images and the actors. But the story, there really  isn't much of one and that to me is a shame. Looking back on Twin Peaks a similar problem is apparent. TP: Fire Walk with Me as a film is really good, if disturbing and unever. I think the problem comes down to the lack of really poetic or beautiful storytelling. Great characters were developed through TP but sadly the film didn't celebrate that. It almost comes across like Lynch didn't really respect the whole Twin Peaks thing. Imagine a simple scene in TP:FWWM where a scene featuring Cooper in Deer Meadow or wherever cuts to Truman in Twin Peaks. That could have been a good bow to their future relationship. Sadly Truman doesn't actually appear in the film. You could say that makes sense since its about Laura centrally. But such a simple scene could enrich the film no end. Just showing people who will meet in the future alongside each other, giving a kind of celebration of the development and richness of Twin Peaks. I know FWWM is a dark and different film to the series but I think that's just the way it turned out. I don't think Lynch and Engels necessarily envisioned it like that, its just how it was finally edited and finished.

Since Lynch has never returned to Twin Peaks since you could say he doesn't care for it much or even respect it. I don't know. Maybe he doesn't rate it highly amongst his film-making ouvre. I don't know which films of his he values most.

I can just imagine if Mark Frost worked with Lynch on a project there would be a more pleasing story and drive to the whole thing. Of course I liked INLAND EMPIRE to some extent but it was just too much of a muchness for my liking. It dealt intensely with feelings and psychological trouble (as did FWWM) that perhaps could be leavened by an interesting storyline.

To me it would be incredibly radical for Lynch to make a film with a talented writer. After all he wasn't trained as a writer so he could give those reigns to someone as talented as Frost and see what happened.

Booth, you know I meant since FIRE WALK WITH ME. True, he did return to Twin Peaks as such then, after the television series. But the fact that he didn't return to it after that does suggest something along the lines of what I suggested. After all, more than one further film was planned after FWWM. It would seem strange of Lynch to give up on that simply because FWWM wasn't successful enough. I would imagine the film made some money. It was pretty successful in Japan for one.

Maybe CIBY were funding the further Twin Peaks idea and just said no after FWWM, fair enough.

But I'm not really aiming to turn this into a 'Twin Peaks should carry on in 2008...' topic. Well maybe not.

What I'm saying is, Booth, that Twin Peaks was one of the most interesting stories/narratives that Lynch has worked on. If he joined up with someone like Mark Frost and made a film with them I just think that would work well. I wonder if Lynch has full respect for narrative.

Don't you agree that Peaks was the best story Lynch has worked on? Granted he didn't direct every episode of the series and didn't dream up the genius Little Nicky storyline for instance, but we can't hold him responsible for everything right?

I can tell you're hanging in for INLAND EMPIRE Part 2 right, Booth? I wouldn't mind if the whole film was about the man with the watches, The Phantom. Love the extra scene on the American dvd with him and the Polish girl. I like that scene better than a lot of the actual film in fact! You could also say that Lynch is not perfect at knowing what to include as well in editing his films! Like with FWWM and Sheryl Lee, in INLAND EMPIRE he concentrated on Laura Dern. So we got about half an hours' worth or more of her walking through dark corridors. I know those corridor scenes shiver your timbers Booth but frankly I was fucking bored!

TP3, you're really saying at least two different things.

On co-writing:
While I adore FWWM, Mulholland drive and Inland Empire, I agree very much on the fact that Lynch should get a co-writer for his next film. He's in constant danger of digging an aesthetic hole for himself that ultimately will lead up his own ass (shite metaphor city!). In Inland Empire you have a woman in trouble (check), alternate realities (check), some mysterious creepy guy in control of the proceedings (check (which films of his do not have this character?)), red drapes (check) - I could go on. However, IE still has a fresh perspective on things. The creepy-ass home movie/behind the scenes look of the film is one thing, the willingness to actually go out of his comfort zone for a few short scenes is another. If he tries to make a film about a woman in trouble again I doubt it will seem very fresh. Frost gave him the opportunity to make a police-oriented soap opera (exactly the genre that was Frost's claim to fame after he story-edited, directed and wrote Kozoll's and Bochco's Hill Street Blues), but with his main themes still there. That was a brilliant move for both. Frost got to a place he couldn't reach on his own, and Lynch got help to make his ideas seem acceptable to a large group of people without dumbing them down. It seems to me Engels was more of Lynch's scribe. I want him to find a co-writer that has some truly interesting and non-lynchian input, or he could direct a script he didn't write - that worked brilliantly for Hotel Room: Blackout and The Straight Story. What's Barry Gifford doing these days?

On your point about lack of respect for Twin Peaks, and lack of Twin Peaks in FWWM, I think that's wrong. FWWM is a completely different beast and it had to be. Have you read the script? The scene with Truman sticks out out like a sore thumb, it only makes the script longer and serves no real purpose except showing a character from the series. Which is fine, but only serves to make the film directionless. Another nugget: in between Bobby picking up Laura for their big score in the woods and arriving there we have a pointless intercut conversation with Pete and Ed at the Gas Farm about dirt on the inside of the windshield. Ed: "That's your territory". Again, fine in itself, but it stalls the film and has no purpose whatsoever. FWWM isn't a soap opera like the series, with one episode being one day, etc. It needs actual narrative progression. About the darkness of it all, that is very much in the script. It's a film about rape, drug use, incest and murdering your only child, after all, and the script didn't change that much. Mostly, Lynch cut the deadweight and the least subtle passages about the Lodge, something I think was dead on. I do think, however, more regulars could have been included. Strangely, no scene with Laura and Josie were written (that would have made more sense than Josie and Truman); and the scene where Leland joins Johnny's birthday party and Laura later gets cocaine from Ben Horne sounds great, but, alas, wasn't filmed. I really think the scenes would have to include Laura or Leland for them to make any sense. I think cutting the "muffin" scene at the Haywards, and the dinner scene where the Palmers speak Norwegian might have been a mistake. They both sound great. Also, the car scene with Buck and Tommy would make sense if only because that's the only case where it hurts the continuity (several people still think Partyland is a separate room at the Roadhouse). But overall, I think all the rest of the cuts were right as it makes the film more focussed. Cooper in the Lodge talking to the MFAP after the series ended? Annie being taken to the hospital with the owl ring? I don't need any of that.

My two Norwegian øre. 

"What credit card do you want to put that on?"
"Caash, prease."

Evenreven, I think you have hit the nail there. It would have been nice to bring in more series characters into FWWM but the film is already long(ish) and Mary Sweeney did a great job on the editing, really sharpened it. I agree that a couple of dropped scenes might have been nice (Laura and Josie, Laura and Johnny).

I think DL is acting well by not doing spinoffs. I don't want to see TP "20 years later". I don't want my favourite characters looking older - and some of the actors are dead now and some wouldn't return. It might have been nice to have season 3 (and 4) but at the right time. The time has passed. I want FWWM deleted scenes and nothing more TP-related. Would anyone want a bunch of lame episodes, directed by journeymen, written by hacks and sinking as low as some of the S2 episodes? No. I think the time has passed.

In case you haven't noticed, David Lynch NEVER does sequels to ANY of his movies. I'm sure he values ALL of his films.

Regarding returning to Twin Peaks to make a season three, I wasn't saying that should happen. It seems strange to suggest though that such a move would mean more Little Nicky/ Evelyn Marsh episodes. I suppose they had a story as such but they were just lacking in intrigue. TP became too mundane in those bad patches. I just felt that Twin Peaks was the most interesting narrative Lynch has directed parts of. You could carry on some kind of Twin Peaks story using none of the actors used in the series, after all. Or one or two. When I was watching the woods scenes in INLAND EMPIRE I was thinking of Twin Peaks the whole time. And The Phantom character seems like he is out of Twin Peaks to me! He reminds me so much of MIKE/ Philip Gerard, a mysterious character. You're not sure if he's up to no good or trying to help in a sense.

Booth, you've not seen INLAND EMPIRE yet then!? You ought to, why the wait?
 

He should add a "The" to the title. That seems to work.

I haven't seen Inland Empire because I haven't had the urge to do so. 

 Are there people who get the horn over Dern? 

-Req

This was always going to be an interesting topic to discuss.

12rainbow, I think OSF is referring to his line in Inland Empire.

tp3, I thought I wrote a pretty well-reasoned (and long) reply to your posts. Don't you have any thoughts in response to it? (Not to sound like a pretentious and self-righteous blowhard, but I think my post deserved something more than talk about Laura Dern's (admittedly nice) ass. Your initial thoughts did too.)

"What credit card do you want to put that on?"
"Caash, prease."

I've amended my comments because I've clearly lost the plot. Le sigh. I think I've reached Twin Peaks saturation point.      

I wouldn't say that. I think tp3's initial post is interesting (if somewhat misguided, perhaps), which is why I bothered writing a real response to it. And he (assuming the "horn" comment connotes heterosexuality) has been here longer than I have.

I also think there's some pointless bitching and n00b'isms going round these days, but not in this thread. Let's complain where complaining is due instead. I gotta say, though, if I see one more thread dedicated to how sucky "Just You" supposedly is, I'm gonna kick someone in the face. I heard you the first time, punks!

"What credit card do you want to put that on?"
"Caash, prease."

A while ago I came to this thread and noticed an amazing post by Evenreven that pretty much summed it all up for me.

Still I feel just to add I truly feel Lynch has an amazing enthusiasm for his work, not easily noticed by those without a bit of understanding of the field in which he works. Simply my opinion.

evenreven, thanks for your reply, i did think it was really good to read and interesting. I agree with you on the co-writer thing. I can't pretend part of me yearns Lynch would make some kind of journey back to TP land, or maybe just a wooded glade...

I assume everyone here is really into Lynch's work but some are more casual or possibly well-adjusted than me about it...who knows. I got sidetracked by other posts and jokey asides.

I will write more but can't right now as I am on a friend's laptop.

All the best for now - I'll see you in the trees. 

"What credit card do you want to put that on?"
"Caash, prease."