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Twin Peaks & FWWM
> Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought
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| 1. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 1:01 AM |
| MargaretLanternman |
Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 3/1/2010 Posts:173
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Well after finally seeing the last episode of Twin Peaks I at last caught up with everybody else and now know what all of the complaints/disappointments were about. I am almost 100% positive that a hundred people before have done something like this before either on this forum or on another forum somewhere else either when the show ended or sometime afterward, either way I am going to play Jerry Springer for a minute and give you my impression and final thoughts of course you are all welcome to give your 2 cents  I'll just start in uh...what the alphabetical order :P Annie Blackburn: I assumed she would be dead by the end of the series given from what we seen in FWWM but maybe she lives after all? Andy Brennan: Living with Lucy Moran I assume...? Bobby Briggs: Planning to marry Shelly sometime after they find out what happened to Leo (or declare him legally dead, whichever comes first) Garland Briggs: He might be one of the few who actually knows intimate details on both lodges and returned to tell about it, maybe he tells Harry and Doc. Hayward that Cooper is actually OB. Dale Cooper: From what we're given by the end of Twin Peaks and the Fire Walk With Me movie, the "real" Dale trapped and is still lingering in the waiting room (red room). Windom Earle: He managed to get into the Black Lodge and tapped into its power and used it to play mind games on Dale Cooper, gets killed by BOB and his soul is either trapped in the lodge or in a piece of wood? Donna Hayward: It looked to me like she was going to leave home so maybe she was planning on meeting up with James somewhere down the road or move in with a friend? Doctor William Hayward: Surprisingly not in police custody after cracking open Ben's skull, accident or not it was Will's aggression that caused Ben's accident in the first place. What would happen if he had pulled out a gun and went all out on him right there, would it have been any different?
Audrey Horne: I'm going to say that she is most likely deceased being that she was handcuffed to the bank vault's gate at the time and pretty much got a point-blank blast. Ben Horne: Either dead or Comatose/Concussed, either way once he recovers he will be in no condition to continue on with the save Ghostwood campaign after having lost Audrey and Donna not accepting him as her father. Ed Hurley: Depressed, seriously depressed and maybe a little guilt-ridden. I mean your wife who was once a suicidal depressed person snaps out of her delusion and is all like "Wtf is going on here?" You can't help but to feel awkward, especially when you have to break the news to your wife that you are getting a divorce :( James Hurley: Isn't he supposed to be returning to Washington or driving further south? I don't remember but either way he is most likely acting as a male hooker(moonlighting as a mechanic) to make ends meet ;) Nadine Hurley: Confused and upset, very upset. She's basically been in a coma (or more accurately a "trance") this whole time and remembers nothing of the events that transpired since her getting bonked on the head. She will most likely be depressed and suicidal once Ed breaks the news to her that they are divorcing. Doc. Jacoby: Still acting as eccentric and cool as always, no foreseeable changes here. Leo Johnson: Serving out his penance for all of the abuse he put Shelly through, sure it may seem psychotic and twisted but I honestly have no compassion for wife beaters, sorry L you did this to yourself. Hank Jennings: Being somebody's prison bitch ;) Norma Jennings: Feeling incredibly awkward at Nadine's return to normality and wondering if Ed is still going to go through with the divorce.
Shelly Johnson: Still working at the diner and possibly planning on marrying Bobby Briggs. Catherine Martell: Taking a bath in $100 bills, seriously after Ben's accident and the death of her husband and brother she practically owns everything and has no one to share it with, Time to hit the town and play cougar with momma's cash, wonder if James Hurley is still in town? Pete Martell: Dead, most certainly. If Audrey was killed from where she was cuffed then Pete who was directly in front of the blast most assuredly would have died. Check mate. Lucy Moran: Living with Andy and having that baby? And still describing things with unnecessary details.
Andrew Packard: Same as Pete, only maybe this time it's perhaps an ironic death maybe? I mean Eckhart planned on blowing him up before and Andrew faked his own death that way but now he really is blown to smithereens. Also do note at how easily he got the key from Catherine, and how Mrs. Martell was nowhere to be found during the entire episode...perhaps she knew it was a bomb and wanted to get rid of two birds with one stone: an annoying husband and a meddling brother? Josie Packard: Apparently she will spend the rest of eternity as part of the Great Northern hotel furniture collection. Laura Palmer: Physically dead, but trapped in the Lodge/Waiting room. Leland Palmer: Same as above. Sarah Palmer: Being possessed by the midget from another place. Harry Truman: Either he knows that this Coop is a fake or is still unaware IDK but either way he maybe BOB's next target.
Well the last episode definitely felt rushed and it is easy to see that Lynch was hurrying trying to close everything before the show ended. I wish that those Twin peaks comics had been made because I would have loved to have known what happened to everyone afterward especially Audrey, Ben, Catherine, Harry, and Shelly. I'm pretty sure that Audrey is dead but you could always say that the white lodge spirit intervened just in time and saved her because she was "worthy" or whatever. The movie kind of confused me more than it did help me to understand things. I was totally thrown by the Annie thing because I was pretty sure that she was dead, in fact her scene in FWWM she says that she is dead doesn't she? I was surprised at how easy it was to gain access to the Waiting Room, Earle merely needed to manipulate Annie's fear and Dale it appears either used the oil or merely searched around for it (or was it his own fear?) I am still unsure of what to think of the Red suited midget, he is must be neutral because he displays both good and evil tendencies but I am surprised at how he just acted creepy the whole time and didn't really do much, just let Windom and BOB run around doing their thing. Anyway if a remake is ever saw through or if we ever get those FWWM deleted scenes I will be happy to get some real definite closure on the many subplots seen in this series. Thoughts?
"This is the Girl."
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| 2. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 2:18 AM |
| REBEL |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
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WOW , OH WOW!!! Ya know This is somethin we need to keep here, I remembered little by little from details but man!!!! Ya are SOMETHIN!!!! Just Blew Me Away!!! I Wanna GIVE YA A HUGE HUG!!! KISS!!!WOOO!! I Dunno about the rest of the Members here BUT, Gotta say this BIG M. Is TOPS!!!!!! Thank You Darlin!!! there would be no end,I think if it were the 2 lodges would still be opened, but no story, after, it's up to what we tp fans thinks here. there is more of characters bob cat (bobby) will hm still be a wild cat, but yeah like cooper said, ya never loved her anyway, but ya see him during dr. jacoby's session he was cryin. so did bobby really love laura? dont see him marryin shelly, though. she was a slice of free pie with Bobby when Leo in the hospital. her as well, yeah Bobby did have a bit of feelins for shelly, but just dont see him wantin to help out. still young, still wild, and free. whatever he wanted to do, but told shelly he would take care of her just didn't see it.
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| 3. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 2:23 PM |
| MargaretLanternman |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 3/1/2010 Posts:173
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Why thank you :)Oh and I didn't take their ages into account, they're both still young and kinda immature (well Bobby for the most part) Shelly would probably simmer down easier than Bobby would being that it showed she actually had a job and liked working there, and has some marital experience even if it was a bad experience.
Interestingly enough I kinda see Bobby as like a middle-aged guy going through his mid-life crisis and sort of doing what James Hurley did and leave town on his hog, at least I could see James settling down with someone (or besides Donna) even if it meant still being out on the open road.
I am still surprised though as to how Doc Hayward never got so much as a fine or something for what he did to Ben I mean it's like everyone's thought at the time was: "Oh no Annie is gone, and Coop has disappeared into the lodge this is way more important than maintaining order in our town!" I was half-expecting to see Hank jump out of from some bushes and shiv Ed in the gut and the whole town in general turn into a riot with people looting and freaking out.
I just re-watched the first episode (the 2 hour one, Idk if it is the same as the pilot prolly not though) and wow Nadine was a bitch before her head injury. I must have skipped over some parts during my first watch-through because I remembered her as being a depressed, helpless woman when actually she was bitchy to beat the band. I actually felt sorry for Mike after she regained her memory, and I definitely felt sorry for Ed and Norma, but as I see it there's no turning back (speaking as if there would be a Season 3 ;)) and I don't see Ed settling back down for Nadine after realizing what he has passed up all of these years even if Nadine has returned to "normal" (to everyone's chagrin) and is scared and freaked out he would just have to take a deep breath and tear off the band-aid.
"This is the Girl."
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| 4. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:46 PM |
| Cooped |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 6/15/2006 Posts:492
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that's the thing; it's popular to hate on nadine's season2 storylines, and i do agree there is a cheeeese to them, but nadine is deeply, severly mentally ill, and i think that most people don't grab this, and miss feeling potential sympathy toward her, seeing her just as a groan inducing character
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| 5. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 6:02 PM |
| Audrey Horne |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 6/30/2007 Posts:259
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I don't know how much snooping around if you're semi-new to Peaks. But there's been been some leaks and rumors of what would have happened to characters -Frost said they had mapped out the beginning of a next season, but can't remember. I think Robert Engels has also talked, and also Harley Peyton. There was talk of the next season being centered on Cooper grappling with his dual nature. Annie Blackburn: Not long for the show, maybe? She was a guest star and on the fast track to other projects. Not to sure how it was reimagined once the show was declared dead, but Lynch and Engels had her in a coma in the hospital wearing the ring -which is promptly stolen by a nurse. Indicating she is not doomed, but now safe. If the show continued, and the Audrey/Cooper plot completely axed, I imagine Annie would live, but probably leave town -but come back again down the line periodically. (god help us) Andy Brennan: More of the same. Hopefully going back to more of season one's writing. Bobby Briggs: marrying Shelly would have a detour since it is a soap opera. There was talk of jumping the show a few years to get the teenagers out of high school. Garland Briggs: All indications point to the writers wanting him to help save Cooper from the black lodge- after that, more Project Blue Book mysteries? Dale Cooper: Was meant to now face his own demons and how to combat Bob (or the evil) within. Heard this was supposed to be wrapped up early and then the time jump would happen. Cooper is out of the FBI and living in Peaks as a town pharmicist. Probably onto a new mystery but still linked to the BOB/Black Lodge mystery. I mean where do you go after that? Maclachlan was star on the rise but was probably stuck in a contract that is harder to get out of than Fenn or Boyle. Windom Earle: A guest star. I would have thought dead with mini appearances. I've heard stories of him coming back and using the power of the Black Lodge to possess people like Randy- the roadie he killed in the chess piece. (this sounds beyond awful to me) Donna Hayward: Who knows? The character went nowhere and had the lame soap 101 who's my father plot. Probably a new direction and if there was the time jump, new possibilities. A big star on the rise, she might want off the show. Doctor William Hayward: Doc not arrested is I think more of the writing team not fully caring about the Donna/Ben plot and getting careless. Since he's Mark Frost's father, I think he'll be around no matter what -and still in search of a decent plot. Audrey Horne: Fenn stated in an AOL interview that Audrey was intended to survive the bank. Fenn and Machlachlan were the two fan favorites, so doubtful they'd kill her off -her predictament seems more like a cliffhanger than a death. The network and/or Frost and Lynch discussed spinning her off into a new show of Audrey going to Hollywood but that was during season two (same with Albert). Billy Zane mentioned about having to come back to find out Audrey is pregnant (vomit). Again, the time jump might have helped reset her character which had the rug pulled out with the aborted Audrey/Cooper plot. But Fenn was bored and frustrated by then and was also a star on the rise. Ben Horne: Probably in a quick coma and resetting him back to his calculating fun ways. This show needed old bad Ben back. Ed Hurley: Always stuck in the B subplots. Think he'd stay the same -with Norma and he finding happiness but Nadine trying to much it up. James Hurley: Who knows. He was really quick in writing postcards and trying up the west coast (Donna receives the postcard a day and a half after he leaves!!) Marshall wanted off the show to persue film, but did jump into Fire Walk With Me. Most likely, he's gone if there was a season three the following fall after season two. Nadine Hurley: Confused and upset, very upset. She's basically been in a coma (or more accurately a "trance") this whole time and remembers nothing of the events that transpired since her getting bonked on the head. She will most likely be depressed and suicidal once Ed breaks the news to her that they are divorcing. Doc. Jacoby: I agree with your take. Maybe a little bit more useful for the Black lodge plots. Leo Johnson: I think he survives. The writers would need a lot of creativity though to keep him around. But he's the casting director's son, so I think he'll be around always. Hank Jennings: Onto other series, and hoping for an occasional guest appearance. Norma Jennings: Status quo. Shelly Johnson: Amick is a team player and will stick with the show. Will do films on hiatus. New snags with Bobby. Rinse and repeat. Catherine Martell: The secret weapon of always saving a scene. Her name brings clout and will keep getting Emmy and Golden Globe noms. She'll do the standard two scenes per episode but probably not seen in every one. Pete Martell: Tricky. Most likely alive. A fan favorite and needed for color. Lynch loves him. I have no idea. Could see the joke of having him in the hospital again avoiding the food. I tried a retelling of having him as a figment of Catherine's unraveling mind when I attempted a third season over at dugpa. Not sure that would happen. Think he lived with some drastic creative writing. Lucy Moran: Stuck with the longest pregnacy storyline. If they did the time jump, it would help. Probably would have reset a new storyline with her.
Andrew Packard: Special guest star -goodbye and thanks for the fun. You're dead. Josie Packard: The big movie star from China. She didn't have time for Peaks anyway. She's probably do the occasional appearance. They filmed a double of her body (not her head) stuck in the red drapes in the Lodge for the finale. Laura Palmer: Sheryl Lee returns as a red head and dies again (true word of mouth). But probably still returns as Laura Palmer in the red room again and again. Fine by me. Laura dead I love, Laura alive I can't stomach. Leland Palmer: They love Ray Wise. I think he'd make an appearance here and there in the red room. Sarah Palmer: Grace talked about Sarah being from a coven, and also having a twin sister -Beth! I think they would experiement with this. But she'd stay a guest star. Harry Truman: Teams up with the One-Armed man in driving him backwards into the black lodge (whatever that means) Talks of him after the time jump of no longer being the town sherriff and is now the town recluse.
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| 6. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 6:04 PM |
| Audrey Horne |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 6/30/2007 Posts:259
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this is from someone's blog when the Gold Box came out... Now that we can all watch TWIN PEAKS from start to finish, the question lingers: what if there had been a third season? Over the years, various snippets of info have slipped out about what future seasons and future films would have depicted, and I think it might be nice to collect that information for those who are interested.
First of all, in the recent DVD documentary, Mark Frost mentions that the theme of the third season would have been about Cooper being both the hero and the villain of TWIN PEAKS. Up until the second season finale, Cooper had mainly been a force of goodness and justice, so for him to become the villain as well would have played into the show's theme of duality.
Recently, a bunch of information about season three was revealed by Matt Haley. Haley is an artist who was trying to create a third season graphic novel which would have been distributed with the Gold Box edition. He got a thumbs up from Mark Frost, and spoke with Robert Engels about the writers' basic plans for year three. Unfortunately, David Lynch nixed the project for various reasons that are probably obvious, a decision that even Haley admits was understandable. However, Haley did reveal some of the things Engels told him about the direction the series would have taken. Apparently, the possession storyline was meant to be wrapped up fairly early in the third season; no surprise there, seeing as how evil Cooper/BOB really couldn't have been the star of the show for 22 episodes. When taking Frost's statement into account, this implies that even after being released from the Black Lodge, Cooper would continue to struggle with his unleashed dark side, possibly for the remainder of the series. After the possession story was finished, the show would jump ahead several years into the future, mainly because many of the characters were high-schoolers and the writers wanted to see what happened when Donna, James, Audrey, Bobby, Mike and Shelly were further along in their lives. In the future, Cooper would quit the FBI and become the town pharmacist (which I can totally see), and Harry would no longer be the sheriff and instead would have become the town recluse.
At some point during the third season, Sheryl Lee was going to join the show again, this time as a redhead (though doubtfully as another one of Laura's cousins). This would attract BOB, who would eventually murder her. This is probably the event which would have set a new storyline in motion. In regards to the show's mythology, the writers were going to reveal that Mike and BOB originated in a world full of creamed corn, which explains all the references to creamed corn in the movie. Haley also described a surreal scene where Truman would drive Mike backwards into the Black Lodge (what the fuck?). Haley has taken some flack for that last part, as some fans got confused and thought this was his idea, dismissing it as nothing more than bad fan fiction. But he didn't come up with that scene; he's just describing what Engels told him. This highlights the fact that much of TWIN PEAKS sounds pretty ridiculous on paper.
Hmmm, what else? Years ago in an interview with Fangoria, Ted Raimi (who played Rusty, the metalhead murdered by Windom Earle) revealed that he was going to return for the third season. Supposedly, Earle was eventually going to escape from the Lodge, possessing some of the dark powers of the beings which dwell there. He would wind up kidnapping a preppy college student (also played by Raimi), and transport the soul of Rusty into the college kid's body. This would have continued the concept of possession and twinning which PEAKS was playing with. I for one am happy to hear that Windom Earle would have lived.
Also in a Fangoria interview, Billy Zane mentioned that he would have likely returned for the third season as well. Apparently, Audrey was going to find out she was pregnant, which would have necessitated the return of John Justice Wheeler to Twin Peaks. This confirms that Audrey survived the bank explosion, which I don't think is a surprise to anybody. Lynch and Frost were actually considering a spin-off series where Audrey goes to Hollywood, which would have been called MULHOLLAND DRIVE. Obviously, this never happened, but Lynch did redevelop the project years later without the Audrey character.
And although this isn't really confirmed, I think it's a safe bet to assume Ben Horne would have returned to his evil ways following his head injury.
Another thing of note is the information contained in some of the spin-off books produced to tie-in with the series. While the books are not exactly canon, the writers did try to reference them when possible. (For instance, in THE AUTOBIOGRAPHY OF FBI SPECIAL AGENT DALE COOPER, Agent Cooper travels to Deer Meadow to investigate the murder of Teresa Banks, and encounters resistance from Sheriff Cable. In FIRE WALK WITH ME, it's Agent Desmond who investigates the murder, as his character was created to replace most of a reluctant-to-return Kyle MacLachlan's scenes. However, the elements of Deer Meadow and Sheriff Cable remain in the film). Anyway, the TWIN PEAKS ACCESS GUIDE seems to offer some clues about a third season. For one thing, the fact that Andrew Packard is alive seems to be well-known in Twin Peaks, perhaps indicating that he went public after the bank explosion. Another interesting fact is the revelation that Major Briggs' work is based at Unguin Field Observatory (U.F.O.). Weird. Also, the book introduces the concept of the Circulars, a tribe that once lived in the area. Apparently, they believed in absolute karma, and would do things such as consume the flesh of good people to absorb their goodness. They would also smear themselves in elk feces so that no one else would try to do the same thing to them. Anyhow, the tribe now exists in Twin Peaks as the Circular Lodge, a secret society whose ways are largely unknown, and who have some mysterious connection to Owl Cave. While this may all be nonsense created just to fill the pages of the Access Guide, many of these facts were indeed written by series writers Harley Peyton, Robert Engels and Tricia Brock, which might indicate they were trying to plant seeds for the show's mythology.
The movie TWIN PEAKS: FIRE WALK WITH ME also contains a handful of clues about what would have come next, as the film was made with the possibility of other sequels and prequels in mind. There's a scene in the shooting script (though it's unknown if it was actually filmed) set immediately after the conclusion of the series. Harry and Doc Hayward burst into Cooper's bathroom, where he's lying on the floor, bleeding and laughing hysterically. They pick him up and take him back to bed. Meanwhile, we see Annie at the hospital shortly after emerging from the Black Lodge. She has the Lodge ring on her finger, and a nurse lifts it off of her.
It's worth noting that all of the scenes featuring Dale and Laura together in the Lodge are, from Cooper's perspective, occurring after the end of the show. David Lynch confirmed that the message Annie gives to Laura about the good Dale being trapped in the Lodge was meant to be used either in the third season or in a future movie. Laura would have written this down, and eventually someone would've found the message, and it would then provide the clue about why Cooper is behaving so strangely, ultimately setting in motion the resolution of Cooper's possession storyline.
Robert Engels has said that, had the story continued, we would have seen more of Agent Chet Desmond and Phillip Jeffries, especially if the producers had trouble securing Kyle MacLachlan for more movies (as they had enough trouble getting him for his small role in FIRE WALK WITH ME). In particular, Jeffries' odd plotline about Judy in Seattle and the ring would have revealed more about the mythology of the Black Lodge. Supposedly, Engels explained that Judy is actually Josie's sister (probably their way of bringing Joan Chen back to the show), which is why Josie was always going to Seattle whenever she got in trouble. So, this implies that Josie's sister is mixed up with the forces of the Black Lodge and with a time-hopping FBI Agent. Interesting.
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| 7. Wednesday, March 31, 2010 9:41 PM |
| MargaretLanternman |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 3/1/2010 Posts:173
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That is probably some of the coolest, freakiest, far-out Twin Peaks stuff I have read in ages. This has inspired me above and beyond my normal twinges to write some serious TP fan fiction... The Creamed corn world is kind of...meh for me, hopefully if it is ever made or at least if a Twin Peaks Ultimania guide (or encyclopedia) is ever produced then maybe more on this planet/world/dimension would be elaborated on. I like the idea of Ben being bad again, which would mean probably (maybe) springing Hank out or getting someone else to mess with Catherine and get his property back. I'd like to see more elaboration on the Giant and the Dwarf, because from what the giant said at the end of the series "one in the same" or something to that effect led me to believe that they are the same entity or something very similar. I also like the idea of Earle surviving somehow, it sort of reminds me of Orochimaru from the Naruto series how he never really seemed to get killed off, or Dante from the Full Metal Alchemist anime. For some reason I keep wanting to see a series that is like Twin Peaks meets Full Metal Alchemist, maybe a brilliant lunatic like Earle somehow manages to manipulate lodge spirits like homunculi and control them to do his bidding.
"This is the Girl."
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| 8. Monday, April 12, 2010 2:58 PM |
| GoldenBuddha12345 |
RE: Twin Peaks Character Analysis and Final Thought |
Member Since 4/12/2010 Posts:13
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Hi, new to this forum and a big twin peaks fan. If the series continued...i would like to see more on the relationship between Mike and Bob. There's a trick and mystery to that relationship.
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