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1. Saturday, October 13, 2007 2:44 PM
12rainbow Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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IE is available to rent now and either no one is watching it, or people just don't want to talk about it.

Nothing to say? Don't know where to start?   

Both of the discussion threads on this forum are cold. 

Is the board just running out of steam in general?

 
2. Sunday, October 14, 2007 6:00 AM
giospurs RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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I am always disapponted that the Lynch board is less frequented or posted in than the TP board as I would rather discuss David's non-TP films than TP. I don't really post about IE though as I didn't particularly like it, I also didn't understand it.

 
3. Sunday, October 14, 2007 7:08 AM
smokedchezpig RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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I participated heavily in the IE thread...lol...maybe too much? I haven't watched it since I loaned it too a co-worker (who enjoyed it!) but everytime I watch it I can usually find something to add to the discussion.  


"Every day holds a new beginning and every hour holds the promise of an Invitation to Love." 

 
4. Sunday, October 14, 2007 7:48 AM
12rainbow RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE: I didn't particularly like it, I also didn't understand it.

I have to concur.  Unlike Mulholland Dr and Lost Highway, I don't get anything more out of it on repeat viewings.  The proverbial thrill is gone.  It's too Modernist, and not visually compelling enough to keep watching for art's sake, letting the interpretation come on it's own.  

 
5. Sunday, October 14, 2007 12:12 PM
giospurs RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:
QUOTE: I didn't particularly like it, I also didn't understand it.

I have to concur.  Unlike Mulholland Dr and Lost Highway, I don't get anything more out of it on repeat viewings.  The proverbial thrill is gone.  It's too Modernist, and not visually compelling enough to keep watching for art's sake, letting the interpretation come on it's own.  


 Exactly, with Mulholland Dr. and Lost Highway, the films are beautiful and thrilling to watch, even for a complete unintellectual but then every time you watch it you can uncover more of the film and understand it on many different levels. If you didn't 'get' IE I'm afraid you won't really get anything out of the film.

 
6. Sunday, October 14, 2007 12:17 PM
LogicHat RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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I still haven't gotten around to purchasing, renting, or watching it. I'm hoping it will be in the local art house theater at some point.

To be honest, nothing I've seen or read so far has made me feel like I'm missing much.


Logic Hat Online- logichat.org


 
7. Sunday, October 14, 2007 2:14 PM
elephantman RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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In retrospect, I think that the inclusion of the Rabbits films into the movie made me feel that there was a bit of kitchen-sinking going on with IE.  I enjoyed the movie in general, but I had to agree with my friend Nick's assessment, when he woke up during Rabbits.  He just sort of blurted out, "What the !@#$?"  Indeed.

-cg 

 
8. Sunday, October 14, 2007 2:22 PM
giospurs RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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It seemed like Lynch was trying to be weird for the sake of being weird, which is the last thing you want. Off-topic, does anyone know what Lynch's proposed next feature is going to be.

 
9. Sunday, October 14, 2007 3:14 PM
LogicHat RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:Off-topic, does anyone know what Lynch's proposed next feature is going to be.

No, and I'm sure he doesn't either.

One thing I am looking forward to (besides the TP stuff) is the Lynch 1 documentary. I find the process behind IE more fascinating than the end product itself. 


Logic Hat Online- logichat.org


 
10. Monday, October 15, 2007 1:00 PM
Robin Davies RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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There's a lot of deep discussion of the film at the INLAND EMPIRE site. I have yet to see any consensus emerging on the plot though.

 
11. Monday, October 15, 2007 7:15 PM
KahlanMnel RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion

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I've had the DVD since it came out in August and yet I haven't watched it yet. Mostly because I really really want to be able to sit down, uninterrupted, and watch it all the way through. I unfortunately have not had what I could call three good solid hours of uninterrupted time since I got the DVD. Which sucks. Maybe this Sunday if I'm caught up enough on my schoolwork...

I just really want to give this movie a fair shake. I've heard people say it was total crap, others say it was meh, and still others who think it's brilliant. But they've all agreed on one thing...gotta watch it all in one go. Otherwise it'll just befuddle me and I'll probably end up turning it off and never coming back. LOL So. Seriously, I want to try and finally watch it on Sunday. I would LOVE to join in some IE discussions, even though I've never been quite good at dissecting films...


~ Amanda

"Just fear me, love me, do as I say and I will be your slave..."

 
12. Monday, October 15, 2007 8:43 PM
jordan RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion

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I'm with Amanda on this one. Have had it since August and just haven't had the time to sit down and watch it. The only thing I've watched was the Cooking with Lynch feature! LOL!


Jordan .

 
13. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 12:47 AM
faceintheleaves RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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I love Inland Empire. It's my third favorite DL film after FWWM and Mulholland Drive. I saw it twice at the cinema and couldn't take my eyes off the screen. It's one of the most beautiful things I've ever seen. I've never cared what other people think of David Lynch films, if only because FWWM has been favourite film of all time since its theatrical release and I've seen so many critics, fans and innocent bystanders run shrieking in horror over the years. I'm fascinated by how people feel about the films, but don't like that "this is what it means" mentality which is prevalent on message boards (particularly IMDB, which I despise).

I think the problem with Inland Empire is, DL films only become popular en masse once people can understand them (think Lost Highway and Mulholland Drive - they both took a while to find their niche). With the exception of FWWM I've never felt I had to understand what things mean and maybe that's why I got so much out of Inland Empire. The first time I saw the film I was sat with my mouth hanging open. The second time my brain was frantically sorting and cross-referencing. My understanding of it is totally subjective and for me that's one of Inland Empire's real strengths - that my interpretation of the film could be so solid, and personal, and nonsensical!  

Inland Empire is the closest a David Lynch film has come to being like a painting. You're not guided through it by one character who points out what's good, bad, happy, sad etc. It does have that 'kitchen sink' mentaility but the Rabbits scenes work very well and looked incredibly beautiful on a big screen. Laura Dern's godly and it was good to see Grace Zabriskie - her scene's one of the highlights of the film IMHO. My only concern is that David Lynch is becoming too self indulgent. It reminds me of a story I once heard about Donatella Versace - her stylist was trying to persuade her to tone down her startling appearence and said "Less is more" and Donatella said "No, more is more" and refused to change a thing.  

DL is one of my all time heroes but between promoting The Air Is On Fire, Inland Empire and the Maharishi university he did about five hundred interviews and by the end I was praying people would stop pointing cameras and dictaphones at him. If you insist on talking but don't have anything much to say there's a danger people will think you just like the sound of your own voice and I suppose that's true of the films too. That said, I have shamelessly purloined "a sadness", "a trauma" and "a thick beauty" for daily use, and shoehorn them into sentences at every available opportunity.  


I ran from the noise and the silence, from the traffic on the streets
 
14. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 5:47 AM
ThisIsTheGirl RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE: 

That said, I have shamelessly purloined "a sadness", "a trauma" and "a thick beauty" for daily use, and shoehorn them into sentences at every available opportunity.  


 Me too! I'm rather fond of "real from a deep place" too!

To me, the prob with INLAND is that too many people who only really discovered Lynch with Mulholland Drive think that it can be decoded in the same way as many reviewers did with that movie - i.e. that there is a definite, singular interpretation which is the "correct" one.

I've always found this curious, since DL himself has always actively discouraged such narrow interpretations of the movie. I think the problem is, a lot of people watched MD, said "WTF?", watched it again, did some research on the net - read one of the "the first two-thirds are all a dream" theories, and found themselves overwhelmed by that interpretation. Possibly in reaction to this, DL has made a film which defies such single-minded interpretation, and demands a more active contribution from the viewer.

Not only that, but he managed to include this outlook within the fabric of the movie itself - I would argue that INLAND is primarily an examination of the imposition of narrative. So there isn't a conventional "plot", but instead there is a series of occurences which are designed to make the viewer think about the general concept of "plot". Similarly, there are no "characters" - rather individuals who convey a sense of character.

I'd say that with IE, Lynch has succeeded in doing something he's been trying to do since Lost Highway.


Has he taken his eyes off it yet?

 
15. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 7:23 AM
giospurs RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:
QUOTE: 

That said, I have shamelessly purloined "a sadness", "a trauma" and "a thick beauty" for daily use, and shoehorn them into sentences at every available opportunity.  


 Me too! I'm rather fond of "real from a deep place" too!

To me, the prob with INLAND is that too many people who only really discovered Lynch with Mulholland Drive think that it can be decoded in the same way as many reviewers did with that movie - i.e. that there is a definite, singular interpretation which is the "correct" one.

I've always found this curious, since DL himself has always actively discouraged such narrow interpretations of the movie. I think the problem is, a lot of people watched MD, said "WTF?", watched it again, did some research on the net - read one of the "the first two-thirds are all a dream" theories, and found themselves overwhelmed by that interpretation. Possibly in reaction to this, DL has made a film which defies such single-minded interpretation, and demands a more active contribution from the viewer.

Not only that, but he managed to include this outlook within the fabric of the movie itself - I would argue that INLAND is primarily an examination of the imposition of narrative. So there isn't a conventional "plot", but instead there is a series of occurences which are designed to make the viewer think about the general concept of "plot". Similarly, there are no "characters" - rather individuals who convey a sense of character.

I'd say that with IE, Lynch has succeeded in doing something he's been trying to do since Lost Highway.


 Well, he deserves to do whatever he wants after giving us the films that he has but I hope that his next feature is a little more mainstream. I've never said that about anything before and it sounds terrible but I think that he will start to lose quite alot of his audience if he carries on being so self-indulgent.

 
16. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 8:48 AM
tp3 RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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I was surprised to read people in this posting saying they disilked INLAND EMPIRE as a whole. I really liked it. Visually I found it more interesting than Lost Highway or Mulholland Dr. What's the problem with the Rabbits? There's always been such characters in his films and they seemed to work well in this.

I really liked the Polish actors and there are some beautiful bits of dialogue and just 'moments' - perhaps the point is they lack a narrative as involving as something like Twin Peaks - you could say that for definite. Inland Empire just rolls on as a narrative of sorts but does perhaps lack a strong line or drive making you wonder where it will lead. There is a mystery as such but it seems totally stubborn to be kept hidden or obscure.


 
17. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 9:21 AM
ThisIsTheGirl RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE: 
 Well, he deserves to do whatever he wants after giving us the films that he has but I hope that his next feature is a little more mainstream. I've never said that about anything before and it sounds terrible but I think that he will start to lose quite alot of his audience if he carries on being so self-indulgent.

 

I hear you. I'd love to see him do something a little more linear next time. I have a funny feeling that he will. But you know it won't be on film!


Has he taken his eyes off it yet?

 
18. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 10:38 AM
faceintheleaves RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:
QUOTE: 

That said, I have shamelessly purloined "a sadness", "a trauma" and "a thick beauty" for daily use, and shoehorn them into sentences at every available opportunity.  


 Me too! I'm rather fond of "real from a deep place" too!

To me, the prob with INLAND is that too many people who only really discovered Lynch with Mulholland Drive think that it can be decoded in the same way as many reviewers did with that movie - i.e. that there is a definite, singular interpretation which is the "correct" one.

I've always found this curious, since DL himself has always actively discouraged such narrow interpretations of the movie. I think the problem is, a lot of people watched MD, said "WTF?", watched it again, did some research on the net - read one of the "the first two-thirds are all a dream" theories, and found themselves overwhelmed by that interpretation. Possibly in reaction to this, DL has made a film which defies such single-minded interpretation, and demands a more active contribution from the viewer.

Not only that, but he managed to include this outlook within the fabric of the movie itself - I would argue that INLAND is primarily an examination of the imposition of narrative. So there isn't a conventional "plot", but instead there is a series of occurences which are designed to make the viewer think about the general concept of "plot". Similarly, there are no "characters" - rather individuals who convey a sense of character.

I'd say that with IE, Lynch has succeeded in doing something he's been trying to do since Lost Highway.


I couldn't agree more. If people could look on the net and find an explanation that pulled the film together I'm sure Inland Empire would be a lot more popular. The problem with fans who discovered DL post Mulholland Drive is many of them seem to need answers to everything. When FWWM was released I didn't know anybody who even liked it. I had to come up with my own answers and was quite happy to do so.      


I ran from the noise and the silence, from the traffic on the streets
 
19. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 12:47 PM
giospurs RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:

I couldn't agree more. If people could look on the net and find an explanation that pulled the film together I'm sure Inland Empire would be a lot more popular. The problem with fans who discovered DL post Mulholland Drive is many of them seem to need answers to everything. When FWWM was released I didn't know anybody who even liked it. I had to come up with my own answers and was quite happy to do so.      


 I really liked FWWM but I still don't really understand everything that happens involving the ring and the disappearance of Chris Isaak but you don't need to to appreciate most of the film. I think if you didn't like FWWM then you still won't even when you understand everything, unlike perhaps, INLAND EMPIRE

 
20. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 3:52 PM
elephantman RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:

What's the problem with the Rabbits? There's always been such characters in his films and they seemed to work well in this.

It's more the issue to me that he had already made this for something else.  I didn't like the fact that it was obviously not intended for this film, but he brought it in because he had it.  There are indeed always weird things in Lynch's films, but I don't like recycling just to be weird.

That being said, I did like the rest of the film quite a bit.  The scenes in the beginning in the dark sound stage particularly drew me in.

-cg

 
21. Tuesday, October 16, 2007 9:52 PM
12rainbow RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:
 

Well, he deserves to do whatever he wants after giving us the films that he has but I hope that his next feature is a little more mainstream. I've never said that about anything before and it sounds terrible but I think that he will start to lose quite alot of his audience if he carries on being so self-indulgent.

If I hadn't followed the interviews and tracked the creative process that led up to IE before seeing it, I totally would have said "holy pretensious ego stroking, batman."  I love that he's still experimenting, but IE may have been more economical as an serial on DL.com

Yes, there are beautiful moments in the film.  (Roughly 20% of it, IMO) I did buy the DVD/soundtrack, after all. 

 
22. Wednesday, October 17, 2007 4:10 AM
ThisIsTheGirl RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:

IE may have been more economical as an serial on DL.com


 I'd agree with that. With hindsight, it's actually quite astonshing that he got IE shown on the big screen at all. I'm glad he did though!


Has he taken his eyes off it yet?

 
23. Wednesday, October 17, 2007 11:36 AM
Laura was a patient of mine RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:

It's more the issue to me that he had already made this for something else. I didn't like the fact that it was obviously not intended for this film, but he brought it in because he had it.

-cg

Though Lynch did make Rabbits for something else, I wouldn't say that it's obvious he didn't intend it for IE... If you had never heard of the Rabbits show would you think those scenes were out of place? A lesser director might have thought of the idea and simply inserted Rabbits clips randomly into the film, but instead Lynch transforms the clips from a mere satire of sitcoms and uses them to make a more profound statement about the emptiness of life. The Rabbits are a major motif throughout the film, and the scenes are always used well and meaningfully. Some people seem baffled by these scenes... I find them one of the most obvious parts of the film. I'm astonished at the backlash against IE by Lynch fans on this board; I'm quite certain that in 20 years this will be nearly universally considered as his most important film along with Blue Velvet.


That god damn trailer's more popular than Uncle's Day in a whorehouse!

 
24. Wednesday, October 17, 2007 11:45 AM
LetsRoque RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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I absolutely loved it. Its a visually stunning 'nightmare' of an experience.

Aside from the aesthetics, I found some of the acting performances and dialogue completely gripping. Laura Dern's performance goes without saying however there were notable others such as Karolina Gruszka, Krzysztof Majchrzak and Grace Zabriskie.

I particularly loved any scene with Peter J. Lucas in it. His sinister little 'tete a tete' with Devon Berk was intimidating and hilarious at the same time.

'There are consequences to one's actions and there would, for certain, be consequences to wrong actions...dark they would be.'


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25. Wednesday, October 17, 2007 2:48 PM
Robin Davies RE: Conspicuous Lack of IE Discussion


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QUOTE:  

To me, the prob with INLAND is that too many people who only really discovered Lynch with Mulholland Drive think that it can be decoded in the same way as many reviewers did with that movie - i.e. that there is a definite, singular interpretation which is the "correct" one.

I've always found this curious, since DL himself has always actively discouraged such narrow interpretations of the movie. I think the problem is, a lot of people watched MD, said "WTF?", watched it again, did some research on the net - read one of the "the first two-thirds are all a dream" theories, and found themselves overwhelmed by that interpretation. Possibly in reaction to this, DL has made a film which defies such single-minded interpretation, and demands a more active contribution from the viewer.

Not only that, but he managed to include this outlook within the fabric of the movie itself - I would argue that INLAND is primarily an examination of the imposition of narrative. So there isn't a conventional "plot", but instead there is a series of occurences which are designed to make the viewer think about the general concept of "plot". Similarly, there are no "characters" - rather individuals who convey a sense of character.

I'd say that with IE, Lynch has succeeded in doing something he's been trying to do since Lost Highway.

Interesting points. But it's not just people who discovered Lynch via Mulholland Drive who have problems with IE. Many long-term Lynchphiles actually dislike it. As for me, I've loved Lynch since Eraserhead came out and, though I love IE's style and mood I can't help feeling a little frustration with it. Normally I'm the first to defend baffling films but I think my problem with IE stems from the fact that it seems to be stuffed to the gills with plot points. It's not a slow drifting film like the work of Antonioni or Tarkovsky and it's not a deliberately disconnected set of surrealist scenes like Un Chien Andalou. There are loads of characters, portentous dialogue full of details and lines repeated by different characters (or aspects of the same character). This rich stew of information seems to invite the viewer to try and piece it together in some way but it seems impossible to make much headway with it. It's difficult even to get much of a handle on the chronology or the number of characters played by the various actors. For example what are the rabbits? On one level they seem to be a parody of a sitcom, but then we see the male rabbit leave the room to connect in some way with Janek and the Phantom. Then later he crops up in Mr K's room. Then again we see the three men at the seance change into the three rabbits. I can't see how these fit together at all. 
 

 

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