Home | Register | Login | Members  

Twin Peaks & FWWM > The pages ripped out...
New Topic | Post Reply
<< | 1 | >>  
1. Monday, April 23, 2007 12:03 AM
ivalinda The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 1/27/2006
 Posts:891

 View Profile
 Send PM
I'm just wondering about this one...What was written on those pages that BOB/Leland ripped out? Were they two pages or more?We see Leland showing the pages to Laura,in the traincar. And one more thing - On the page,that Harold ripped out and sent to Donna,Laura describes Cooper's dream( in the red room) and she writes "I whispered the secret in his ear" Did she know at that time what the secret was? And if she knew why didn't she write it in her diary? It's a little bit confusing...


Beware of BOB

BOBBOB

When I call out no one can hear me,when I whisper he thinks the message is for him only..my little voice inside my throat,I always think there must be something that I've done or something I can do...But no one no one comes to help,he says,a little girl like you...

 
2. Monday, April 23, 2007 12:32 AM
craig bennett RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 4/22/2007
 Posts:19

 View Profile
 Send PM
maybe she did write it in her diary and thats why Leland/BOB ripped them out, to bury the evidence

 
3. Monday, April 23, 2007 10:26 AM
geoffr111 RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 12/20/2005
 Posts:2231

 View Profile
 Send PM

They never did do a very good job in the series of revealing what there was to see in those ripped diary pages.  In ep 2, just before Albert arrives, Coop shows Harry (just before tweakinghis nose) the bloody towel that Hawk found up the railroad tracks from the crime site.  There is mentioned also that he found faded pieces of paper... i forget the exact wording right now.  Later, Gordon Cole calls up and on the speaker phone says that lab work has proved that these were pages from a diary.

So... were these legible pages?  Apparently not.  Seems like a pretty strange thing to bring up and then let drop.  Maybe they were planning to use the illegible pages to posit that Laura had kept a second diary that would be (and finally was) revealed in season two.

And in terms of what was on the pages... it seems to me that they probably didnt contain anything that would reveal the "true" identity of BOB, since in FWWM Leland/BOB, during the murder scene in the train car, says "your diary... I always thought you knew it was me.  You knew it was me."  So the pages were apparently some sort of evidence that she didn't know.


 
4. Thursday, April 26, 2007 11:38 AM
littleotik RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 7/9/2006
 Posts:169

 View Profile
 Send PM

If you remember the events in movie than you know what were on the pages. 

 

"Stay away from me"


twitter/ josephallenart 

josephallenart.com 

 
5. Thursday, April 26, 2007 8:26 PM
geoffr111 RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 12/20/2005
 Posts:2231

 View Profile
 Send PM
?? They never come out and say what is on them.  What do you mean?


 
6. Thursday, April 26, 2007 9:05 PM
ivalinda RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 1/27/2006
 Posts:891

 View Profile
 Send PM
Laura found out it was her father the night before she was killed.


Beware of BOB

BOBBOB

When I call out no one can hear me,when I whisper he thinks the message is for him only..my little voice inside my throat,I always think there must be something that I've done or something I can do...But no one no one comes to help,he says,a little girl like you...

 
7. Thursday, April 26, 2007 11:19 PM
Gordon RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 12/18/2005
 Posts:5617

 View Profile
 Send PM

Right, she gave the diary to Harold before finding out who BOB was... And the page where she writes that and about the dream where she saw Coop, thought he was Mike, etc. was still in the diary, not torn out. Harold sent it to the real Mrs. Tremond and as a result the page arrived to Donna and Coop.

Now in the movie it seems that when she leaves Harold that's the last time she sees him, but that last entry is written later...that's the discrepancy. I remember we used to *fix* that considering that Laura returned to Harold's to write that final entry, "This is the night that I die etc.".

 
8. Sunday, April 29, 2007 5:25 PM
Zodas RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 12/24/2005
 Posts:400

 View Profile
 Send PM

Many of them had to do with Laura and James going by Lelands curiosity in the relationship.

 Anything else can be chalked to incriminating evidence against BOB.


"Wake up and find out what the hell yesterday was about. I'm not too keen on tommorow, and today's slipping by."
 
9. Thursday, May 3, 2007 2:43 PM
Cypher RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 4/9/2007
 Posts:87

 View Profile
 Send PM
It isn't until Fire Walk With Me that we learn Laura and Teresa were even familiar with each other.  The movie paints an even less convenient picture of Leland and the Palmer family at large.  Sarah does seem terrified at times by Leland's handling of Laura and we see Leland is an unfaithful husband as well.  His culpablility becomes much murkier; Teresa might be a surrogate for Laura and there's some question in my mind if BOB perhaps just exacerbated Leland's darkness moreso than created it.  He even has a motive for killing the girl that exists outside of BOB's need to rampage:  the girl was attempting to blackmail him.  My guess is that the missing pages not only contain Laura's revelation's about her father's identity, but also her suspicions that he may be a serial killer responsible for the Banks' murder.  While Laura was killed in an unpremediated manner because she defied BOB, Teresa may've been murdered in order to silence her.


Got up early, found something's missing/ My only name/ No one else sees but I got stuck/ And soon forever came

 
10. Sunday, May 6, 2007 9:36 PM
geoffr111 RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 12/20/2005
 Posts:2231

 View Profile
 Send PM

This is more a problem I've had with FWWM than your theory, Cypher, but I just don't really like the idea that BOB would be worried about minutiae like blackmail.  I mean, he can just kill and then leave the body of his host if he gets caught (like he did in ep. 16) ...so the way I see it, there's no real threat to him in Teresa's extortion and it's therefore not a motive for murder.

Regarding Leland's role in the murder, we are supposed to believe at the end of ep. 16 that "They made me kill that girl Teresa" and that "when he was gone, I couldn't remember!"  ...So as ever, it's unclear as to the extent of Leland's involvement and participation in BOB's shenanigans.

FWWM made Leland's possession more of a human problem, and hence, more problematic in general.  Would a wood spirit like BOB really pay a hooker for sex?  Can BOB negotiate rote tasks like the handling of money?  And what about Sarah and Leland's marriage?  Does it count since Leland was possessed?  Marlowe's Faustus states that demons can't get married since marriage is a holy sacrament.  Let's conjecture wildly.  Weeeee!


 
11. Sunday, May 6, 2007 3:06 PM
Cypher RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 4/9/2007
 Posts:87

 View Profile
 Send PM

I think you're very right.  I don't see BOB carrying on some illicit affair or fearing its fallout.  Leland himself has the most to lose there and just may have killed the girl of his own volition, which I imagine would only further cement BOB's hold over him.  I do think that the movie portrays Leland in an even darker manner than the series and has Laura-- to our knowledge not connected with Banks in the TV episodes-- come to suspect that her father may be a murderer.  Even Cooper in the series proper seems to be uncertain about the role Leland played in his crimes.  My sense from the film is that Leland is engaging in activities that can't solely be attributed to BOB's influence.  His affair with Teresa is just that-- not a brutal terrorization as with Laura, but a case of infidelity that reveals the Palmers' marriage had internalized problems not involving the supernatural.  Sarah, for all her gifted abilities, also comes off as rather blind to the monster dwelling in her own home.  There are sequences that imply his incestuous possessiveness of his daughter may be innate and not wholly an evil arising from without.  This might cause him to seek out a girl who's the same age and type as his own daughter.  I'm not entirely convinced that the Banks murder can be solely blamed on BOB; the blackmail element is a very real motive for Leland to be rid of the girl with BOB perhaps also claiming credit.   Laura's realization may be a doubled horror:   her father is not the man she thought he was in more ways than one, living a literal and figurative double life.  Not only is he the nightmare figure that haunts her,  but he's also enmeshed in the town's seedy underground sex trade and perhaps a killer in his own right.  Their near-meeting at the hotel is queasy and devastating.  Laura has fled into the trashy nighttime world of Twin Peaks in order to escape her abuser, only to discover later that he was already part of it.


Got up early, found something's missing/ My only name/ No one else sees but I got stuck/ And soon forever came

 
12. Sunday, May 6, 2007 9:38 PM
geoffr111 RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 12/20/2005
 Posts:2231

 View Profile
 Send PM

QUOTE:
Their near-meeting at the hotel is queasy and devastating.  Laura has fled into the trashy nighttime world of Twin Peaks in order to escape her abuser, only to discover later that he was already part of it.


 Ooooh, nice!  :)


 
13. Monday, June 29, 2009 5:27 AM
LetsRock75 RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 6/24/2009
 Posts:27

 View Profile
 Send PM
QUOTE:

Regarding Leland's role in the murder, we are supposed to believe at the end of ep. 16 that "They made me kill that girl Teresa" and that "when he was gone, I couldn't remember!"  ...So as ever, it's unclear as to the extent of Leland's involvement and participation in BOB's shenanigans.

FWWM made Leland's possession more of a human problem, and hence, more problematic in general.  Would a wood spirit like BOB really pay a hooker for sex?  Can BOB negotiate rote tasks like the handling of money? 


 Sorry to ressurect an old thread, I am bored in work and trawling!

I don't see the majority of Lelands actions as purely Leland or BOB, but a combination of both, in a "chicken or Egg" scenario.   You are right, a wood dwelling evil spirit probobly wouldn't be bothered with hookers, but if BOB has entered Leland and used him to do really dark things, Leland then gets drawn in to the dark side of life and starts to behave more darkly.

If he had been co-erced in to hurting his daughter so badly, and he consciously or unconsciously has some memory of that, the sense of shame and dirtiness may drive him into ever dirtier more horrific acts.

 Look at laura - if she hadnt been subjected to the "attentions" of BOB, through leland, at such a young age, she probobly wouldnt have been using drugs, sleeping around, blackmailing etc.

I think it was LELAND that slept with hookers, killed Theresa, and I think he did it cos his whole life had become filthy and meaningless, through contact with BOB et al.

I just wonder which came first though - is BOB attacted to a host cos he senses inherent evil or darkness in that persons soul, and knows (s)he will be a useful host, or is BOB just attracted to anyone, and does that person become darker through association with BOB?


The Norwegians are leaving!
 
14. Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:55 AM
robert RE: The pages ripped out...


 Member Since
 6/26/2009
 Posts:49

 View Profile
 Send PM

 

I just wonder which came first though - is BOB attacted to a host cos he senses inherent evil or darkness in that persons soul, and knows (s)he will be a useful host, or is BOB just attracted to anyone, and does that person become darker through association with BOB?

 A boy named Leland, ten years old or whatever, is walking happily among the houses in Pearl Lakes. An hour later his face is pale, and eyes are empty. What I am gonna write aren´t "mine" theories, they´re widely spread among the Peakers who can´t stand the Sacharine-version of Twin Peaks. This is the spooky version, the real-life-version. And imagine real life is always _beyond_ fiction. ALWAYS! Enough said!

 This event changed Leland´s life forever. This man "Robertson" moved away from Pearl Lakes but his deeds wouldn´t leave Leland until ep. 16, when Leland died (from my point of view a suicide - he finally fully understood what he had done, the charade was over).

Even though "Robertson´s" dirty deeds and memories haunted Leland from time to time, he could still have a normal life, but one day at work something happened. A copy of Fleshworld was floating around in the office and he had a look of a girl which started to haunt him. I know this girl. When he comes home his own daughter greets him with a smile and Leland shakes with horror when he hugs her and swears that noone´s gonna hurt my little baby.

Weeks later he´s sitting with a copy of Fleshworld, and his mouth is producing saliva. He´s crawling deeper and depper into his thoughts - his doppelganger is confronting him openly. The doppelganger is starting to fill the holes and replace his conscience.  His animal instincs are starting to take over, pleasure and suffering, he wants to rape the girl in the paper. The fundamental and primitive parts of Leland - even though Leland wasn´t consiously aware of them - who enjoyed "Robertson´s deeds" is starting to take over. Lelands doppelganger was conceived decades ago, but is now born, re-born.

This urges, this doppelganger, this "Robertson", "BOB", "grayhaired man" is constantly confronting Leland, telling him to let go, to give in... and why not, I only want to talk to this girl, she does remind me of someone, but I can´t remember who... metaphorically speaking, Leland is in the Black Lodge and is facing his shadow-self, he hesitates, he´s scared when he sees the raw energy of himself. His self-control is giving in and the raw energy, BOB, is laughing together with Lelands shadow-self. The shadow-self has now grown strong and mocks Leland openly, whispers about the elation that´s waiting for him, just around the corner. Little Leland, ten years old perhaps, tells the older Leland to give in. The doppelganger starts to chase him, stabs him, becomes him.

A week later Laura is twelve years old.... or is she eleven.. or ten.. who cares.. Leland is watching her with new eyes and a "new" conscience, starts to drug his useless wife, starts the fan, starts to climb the walls of Palmer´s house. This is now Leland, it´s Robertson, he has long hair, and a long name too, I am BOB, and now I AM GOING TO MOLEST LELANDS DAUGHTER!


Let´s tip their power balance, tear down their crown,

Educate the masses, let´s burn the white Lodge Down!

 

New Topic | Post Reply Page 1 of 1 :: << | 1 | >>
Twin Peaks & FWWM > The pages ripped out...


Users viewing this Topic (0)


This page was generated in 188 ms.